Hello and welcome to LatiasWebs first Comunity create a team project. Here we will work together to get up a team based around a pokemon in this case INFERNAPE!

I say NP, I voted for that, but the second option would be SD.

You can vote for more than one....

I voted for the mixed sweeper absolutely. He's ready to go from the moment he hits the ground, and he can slay dragons with hidden power [ice] as well as lots of other stuff. With life orb and two STABs he has plenty of firepower and 4 moves for good coverage unlike set-up sets. Is this going to be an end game sweeper? Flamethrower would be nice.

By the way we should use this team to ladder and see how we fare.

I'd go either nasty plot, SD, or mixed. With NP, I suggest a prority move as well as screen support. Likewise with SD. With mixed, I suggest BP support.

Ulver wrote:

By the way we should use this team to ladder and see how we fare.

That's problamy the last step, yes.

We need more votes and make a decision soon.

We'll need a few more votes. I'll ask people to come vote.

We need a way to make more people join and all members to vote.

Are we still going along with this?

Well since we are going with nasty plot Infernape we have ourselves a strong wall breaker. I say keep that in mind while thinking about the next pokemon to pick. Also Latias is obviously a very easy pokemon to pair with Infernape, but is it the best? I say if we do use Latias we go with a defense mono-attacker set that has refresh. That would add so much character and bulk to the team instead of it just being a faceless mashing together of offensive pokemon, which I'm starting to find unappealing. Or we could look past Latias and think about what other interesting pokemon could go good with Infernape beyond the obvious. Some esoteric combination might even be better. Focusing on what goes good with a, and then what goes good with a+b, and then what goes good with a+b+c, etc., is an imperfect and cookie cutterish process that will lead to a boring and less strong team.

How about pairing nasty plot Infernape with subpetaya Empoleon and standard Rotom-C? I came to this idea by thinking of what would compliment Infernape as a sweeper, and I thought it would be something that can take down all the pokemon that out speed Infernape. Empoleon can do something like 80%-95% to Latias with ice beam so we have very good odds there. It will easily wipe the floor with just about anything else that isn't a water type, although Starmie will take quite the dent from surf. Then Rotom-C helps Empoleon with leaf storm for bulky waters and helps both Empoleon and Infernape through its excellent typing. Furthermore it can stand it's own ground with will-o-wisp and bulk.

That's one proposal off the top of my head for an offensive core. Now I would think about counters and how to form a defensive core / solid lead that will be the most threatening and difficult for the opponent to deal with. Things like maximum HP and defense Jirachi with wish and calm mind come to mind. Not that we would probably do that...since it gives us three ground weaknesses, but just as an example.

Hmm, it looks nice put i think we should slow down. I think this is the set we're gonna use right?:

Infernape @ Life orb
Naive nature
EV: 64 Atk 252 SpA 192 Spe

Nasty plot
Fire blast
Grass knot
Close combat

That is standard smogon NP set. I personly think we should start with using us off a simple list of pokemons that can counter a Infernape sweep and then build our team after that.

To start of Latias is the hugest counter in OU for Ape. *Adding him to the list*
Gengar and Starmie should be added to the list due to being able to revenge kill him far to easy *smelling Scizors gonna be used here*. So the list at the moment looks like this:

Latias
Gengar
Starmie

Feel free to post your own pokemons that can counter him. Then out of the complete list we'll build a team, ok?

Well, we don't need to revenge kill latias, it should be better to be able to counter it, not killing it after our infernape is dead. Useful would be a lure, so we need pokemons that can lure latias, starmie and/or gengar in.

From what I've seen, a gyarados often makes gengar, starmie and latias appear, so I would suggest him.

Then, we would need a counter, so I wil suggest an electivire, a metagross, a scizor, or a tyranitar.

Gyarados lures them in and die. We would need to scarf it, it's that really a good idéa? No. Scarfed pokemons has to switch in back and forth and cannot be weak to Stealth rock. Or you mean that we switch in Gyara, makes them switch in Latias and then switches in Gross to take T-Bolt? That seems quite unecessary.

Well this is an example of what involves good reasoning but just won't work so well in practice. I think it commits way too many pokemon to accomplish a single goal and neglects the overall development of the team. The team needs to have threats of its own or else it won't be able to properly clear the path for Infernape.

You are right and wrong there. When building a team around a pokemon most of the time 2 pokemons will counter his counters. Then you usually focus on threatening the opponent. I think that we should start by killing Latias. THEN looking on our own ways sweep/clear up other than Ape.

HP ice over GK on nape or you are dragon weak. I suggest that you put in the steps of how are we going to do a CCAT. Eg Mvst of poke, teamates, etc.

Ok I think you guys are way too focusing in countering threat to Ape,I see we first need a "partner" that can help Infernape in some other way like giving it the right support,Gengar and Starmie are a problem because of their speed,not their bulk,and with that in mind Para support will be very valuabe,Jirachi,Celebi,Cresselia,and Rotom variant get special mention,all have their pros and cons,Jirachi have an added bonus that it can take on Latias one on one,but share ground weakness and risk being trapped by Magnezone,Celebi have a nice synergy with Nape and the tinkerbell set allow it not to be trapped by common pursuitter like T-Tar and Scizor,however it not enjoy take Ice Beam from Starmie or other pokes in general,Cresselia with her bulk compensate Nape frailness,in the other hand she is more susceptible to Pursuit,Rotom have nice synergy with Nape and also quite bulky and additionally can take on bulky-water quite well,but again is weak to pursuit.

Well no matter what, We should start by clearing out what exact set Ape should run.


Infernape @ Life orb
Naive nature
EV: 64 Atk 252 SpA 192 Spe

Nasty plot
Fire blast
Grass knot/HP Ice
Close combat

HP Ice or Grass knot? Or does anyone have anyother thing they want to point out?

I would say HP Ice, grass knot does not give that good coverage exept for gyarados, swampert, or hippowdon, it would also help against latias if we know she is modest.

Infernape can kill dragons with fire blast. It's nasty plotted...

I'm going to be honest I have an issue with fire blast on such an important sweeper. Our whole game could be for nothing if it misses, which is a big deal. Then again I favored the mixed sweeper. I rather use flamethrower myself although it won't always kill Salamence in that case, it should get him most of the time. It will lose out on neutral coverage against the most bulky pokemon but...15%. I just can't stomach that.

Celebi would be a good pair for Infernape type-wise and strategy wise as well. A tinker bell set could do very well, or some custom set. I think we should probably try to have some foresight with the Celebi pick though...if we go with Celebi what else will we want?

Well, I don't like fire blast much too,I prefer flamethrower by way much, but Fire blast won't do that much damage to flygon, latias, kingdra, and maybe dragonite?
Also, a celebi is not a bad idea, T-wave is pretty good, wich could help against starmie and latias.

I have no problem with using Flamethrower. The we are at GK/HP problem again. A +2 Flamethrower will easily K0 Dragonite after Stealth rock. Latias before Calm mind would be badly hurted. I'd problably have to say GK.

Celebi idéa is cool. I were thinking that we would use it ever since i started this ccat. I'd like something like this:

Celebi @ Leftovers
Timid nature
EV: 232 HP 24 SpA 252 Spe (Totally random spread)

Thunder wave
Recover
Leaf storm
HP [Dark] << Crazy idéa but might work

The HP Dark will kill Gengars and Starmies. Latias problably isn't gonna take ver much from it.

That Celebi will be easily trapped and killed. A tinker bell set could take care of Scizor and hurt Tyranitar a lot. Starmie and Gengar would die anyways unless they kill Celebi first. Also I'm still not comfortable with choosing Celebi without knowing what our third choice will be. At this point I'm having a hard time figuring out what else should go on the team. Infernape and Celebi seems like a solid enough core. They have good type synergy, both stand on their own as solid pokemon, and have a little bit of synergy between them.

Let's see...we could run a Blissey with toxic, flamethrower, thunderwave, and softboil. That way it could come in on Gengar or Starmie and deal some hurt to the opposing team most likely. That would also cover special threats and leave us more flexibility with our last three choices of pokemon. Celebi could even be dropped. I guess Blissey on a team designed for sweeping late game seems weird but Blissey is a monster and no other pokemon would do as good as it when it comes to thunderwaving.

What about scarf celebi/shaymin? It will take care of gengar, starmie, tyranitar etc.